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I'm sure there should be some old threads on this, but I just had a look and can't find any.
Fancied it a go this winter, just so I know the options available to me if I like it. I'll probably get too cold and not do it again, but at least it means I'll be *choosing* not to climb over winter, not having that choice forced on me by the dark evenings.
So I've got two questions:
a) What extra equipments/lights do you need, can you get away with just a petzl headtorch?
b) How many grades should you drop? I normally lead VS, so was thinking along the lines of a well protected VDiff crack that I've done before.
Cheers.
Fancied it a go this winter, just so I know the options available to me if I like it. I'll probably get too cold and not do it again, but at least it means I'll be *choosing* not to climb over winter, not having that choice forced on me by the dark evenings.
So I've got two questions:
a) What extra equipments/lights do you need, can you get away with just a petzl headtorch?
b) How many grades should you drop? I normally lead VS, so was thinking along the lines of a well protected VDiff crack that I've done before.
Cheers.
In reply to cider nut: It's good fun-go out and do it. One thing I have done in the past is use a headtorch on my head, and then attach a tikka below one knee on one leg (or both if you have two (tikas, not legs)) which will shine on your feet so you can see where they're going-it works suprisingly well, although you look strange if you forget to take it off afterwards.....
Sam
Sam
In reply to sam the man: Plus on a clear night, with a bright moon you don't need any torchage.
Sam
Sam
In reply to cider nut:
I think you should do it without a headtorch...surely thats the proper spirit of night climbing...what for a full moon!
I think you should do it without a headtorch...surely thats the proper spirit of night climbing...what for a full moon!
In reply to cider nut: I go out and night climb every winter,a after work. I haven't done anything over HVS O/S but i recon if you no the route you can climb anything.
Gear takes a bit longer to place, route finding is a nightmare! But you dont feel as exposed ! and the climbing is just like in the light.
Gear takes a bit longer to place, route finding is a nightmare! But you dont feel as exposed ! and the climbing is just like in the light.
In reply to cider nut: I'd always fancied easy scottish Gullies in moonlight,
Sarah and I do night time fell running. really get out in the mountains at night. I'd love to do Grib Goch at night, cold, moonlit night.
One of my best memories is being at the back of Tryfan in full moonlight with a temperature inversion. All the peaks sat above the cloud bathed in sunlight. One of the greatest sights I have ever seen.
Sarah and I do night time fell running. really get out in the mountains at night. I'd love to do Grib Goch at night, cold, moonlit night.
One of my best memories is being at the back of Tryfan in full moonlight with a temperature inversion. All the peaks sat above the cloud bathed in sunlight. One of the greatest sights I have ever seen.
In reply to IanJackson: A mate here in Snowdonia does lots in winter at night, quite high E grades. Route finding must be tricky but he still climbs a similar level somehow.
In reply to IanJackson:
What's your normal OS grade? Just trying to work out how much to drop.
> I haven't done anything over HVS O/S but i recon if you no the route you can climb anything.
What's your normal OS grade? Just trying to work out how much to drop.
In reply to cider nut: Good to see you at the grouse, btw night climbing is fine just picl routes with care and make sure it's clear night with a good moon.
Crags like llewydd are a poor choice.
Crags like llewydd are a poor choice.
In reply to cider nut:
well, if they made moonlight look like sunlight I guess not.....
> (In reply to IainRUK)
>
> Do you just run with normal torches?
>
> Do you just run with normal torches?
well, if they made moonlight look like sunlight I guess not.....
In reply to Anonymous: we use the Petzl Myo XP, Would be plenty good enough for climbing, good beam, but also good diffuser which may help climbing.
In reply to Dr.Strangeglove: oops meant moon light
This is it. Picture does not do justice.
http://sarzmountainrun.blogspot.com/2007/02/thursday-night-run-above-clouds...
This is it. Picture does not do justice.
http://sarzmountainrun.blogspot.com/2007/02/thursday-night-run-above-clouds...
In reply to cider nut:
The only route I've done by night was Red Wall in Pembroke. I had my headtorch plus additional lighting from t'bloke (who I think was worried I was going to kill myself). Found the climbing easy enough, even in the dark, but I wouldn't have fancied faffing with gear and it was a severe so 2 grades less than my comfort grade.
The only route I've done by night was Red Wall in Pembroke. I had my headtorch plus additional lighting from t'bloke (who I think was worried I was going to kill myself). Found the climbing easy enough, even in the dark, but I wouldn't have fancied faffing with gear and it was a severe so 2 grades less than my comfort grade.
In reply to cider nut:
I can't comment on halogen headtorches, but LED light makes everything very flat, so it's tricky to judge handholds and even trickier to place gear. You keep thinking "ooh, that looks like a good number 5 nut placement" only to discover it's actually a crack wide enough to put your head in, or vice versa.
I'd recommend cracks as then route finding isn't a problem.
It's awesome.
I can't comment on halogen headtorches, but LED light makes everything very flat, so it's tricky to judge handholds and even trickier to place gear. You keep thinking "ooh, that looks like a good number 5 nut placement" only to discover it's actually a crack wide enough to put your head in, or vice versa.
I'd recommend cracks as then route finding isn't a problem.
It's awesome.
In reply to cider nut:
With a full moon you might not even need a torch (though I'd stick to places or even routes you know). I did know the route and the bomber gear on it though - from experience sans torch benightment the scary thing is you can't see your gear so you're glad of things like big cams in breaks etc.
Trusting your feet becomes automatic, because there's no other option but to do so.
Things at Avon however once the gear is in, have been alright - ambient street light is good as is in situ gear, and the effect of exposure on your head is lessened as you can't see the big drop. Night climbing may be a cure for vertigo then. Ally did loads of training on wired crimpy vertical routes/ problems at night at the same place
If you're a local to be honest I can't see the point. I think I've either been benighted, psyched for a route or keen to get something done on a weekend trip while it's dry.
I am still dissappointed I didn't do the Cuillin Ridge one night on my first Syke trip (the only time it stopped raining). It'd be well doable in that northern summer short half night. But what do I want to go down and do my local VD again at night for?
With a full moon you might not even need a torch (though I'd stick to places or even routes you know). I did know the route and the bomber gear on it though - from experience sans torch benightment the scary thing is you can't see your gear so you're glad of things like big cams in breaks etc.
Trusting your feet becomes automatic, because there's no other option but to do so.
Things at Avon however once the gear is in, have been alright - ambient street light is good as is in situ gear, and the effect of exposure on your head is lessened as you can't see the big drop. Night climbing may be a cure for vertigo then. Ally did loads of training on wired crimpy vertical routes/ problems at night at the same place
If you're a local to be honest I can't see the point. I think I've either been benighted, psyched for a route or keen to get something done on a weekend trip while it's dry.
I am still dissappointed I didn't do the Cuillin Ridge one night on my first Syke trip (the only time it stopped raining). It'd be well doable in that northern summer short half night. But what do I want to go down and do my local VD again at night for?
In reply to cider nut:
I remember doing my first E1, solo, in the dark. Topping out and looking down and just seeing the bottom of the climb. I had top roped it before so doesnt really count.
I remember doing my first E1, solo, in the dark. Topping out and looking down and just seeing the bottom of the climb. I had top roped it before so doesnt really count.
In reply to IainRUK:
I do night time fell running during the winter too and if you pick a clear night, it’s amazing how light it can actually be when the moon is out and the sky is clear. Torch not always needed - your eyes soon adjust. Think if you pick a crag that’s not overshadowed by trees etc. you’ll be fine.
I do night time fell running during the winter too and if you pick a clear night, it’s amazing how light it can actually be when the moon is out and the sky is clear. Torch not always needed - your eyes soon adjust. Think if you pick a crag that’s not overshadowed by trees etc. you’ll be fine.
In reply to sam the man: A head torch pointing down from the waist gives a better spread for foot holds.
In reply to stuckonarock:
It used to be traditional back in the day to convoy-solo DMinor at Arapiles (100'?, Oz 14/ VS'ish) by moonlight when the full moon came around. No torches. The crux is quite high up but the moon glow tends to make everything look dreamy and harmless. All the same, I vividly recall having a WTF moment near the top.
> I do night time fell running during the winter too and if you pick a clear night, it’s amazing how light it can actually be when the moon is out and the sky is clear.
It used to be traditional back in the day to convoy-solo DMinor at Arapiles (100'?, Oz 14/ VS'ish) by moonlight when the full moon came around. No torches. The crux is quite high up but the moon glow tends to make everything look dreamy and harmless. All the same, I vividly recall having a WTF moment near the top.
In reply to cider nut:
A few tips, a petzl type headtorch with a beam and LEDs is fine, never needed more than this as you can see the footholds ok.
However a headtorch light is poor when you are sitting around or walking so for years we have taken a paraffin lamp which gives a warm glow and lasts a night.
Yes it gets cold so a hot drink and maybe some hot food, if there are more than two of you it give you something to do when your not climbing.
The biggest problem with night climbing, if you came by car is where you can safely leave it. The popular end car park of Stanage is very isolated at night and is a regular breakin spot. We leave the car in pub carparks and this dictates the climbing venues.
In the Peak you can offset this by walking and linking up different crags, so Millstone Inn, Millstone, Higgar Tor, Stanage , Millstone Inn.
The great night climb is the Edges, start at Stanage End and finish at Chatsworth with any combination of routes on the way.
As for the grade adjustment, you will have to play it by ear.
A few tips, a petzl type headtorch with a beam and LEDs is fine, never needed more than this as you can see the footholds ok.
However a headtorch light is poor when you are sitting around or walking so for years we have taken a paraffin lamp which gives a warm glow and lasts a night.
Yes it gets cold so a hot drink and maybe some hot food, if there are more than two of you it give you something to do when your not climbing.
The biggest problem with night climbing, if you came by car is where you can safely leave it. The popular end car park of Stanage is very isolated at night and is a regular breakin spot. We leave the car in pub carparks and this dictates the climbing venues.
In the Peak you can offset this by walking and linking up different crags, so Millstone Inn, Millstone, Higgar Tor, Stanage , Millstone Inn.
The great night climb is the Edges, start at Stanage End and finish at Chatsworth with any combination of routes on the way.
As for the grade adjustment, you will have to play it by ear.
In reply to cider nut:
I've done a couple of routes at night, mostly easy stuff with a good moon, a headtorch and wine to keep me warm. Routfinding is the main issue. Fun but terminally silly.
Last winter I got out bouldering pretty much as often as I would normaly have managed despite the dark. Pick venues where the landings are ok and it's fine with a headtorch. I mark a big chalk X on the pad as an aiming point (makes judging depth easier and helps prevent jarred knees) and all the holds get chalk ticks (they wash off where I climb so no big deal).
jk
I've done a couple of routes at night, mostly easy stuff with a good moon, a headtorch and wine to keep me warm. Routfinding is the main issue. Fun but terminally silly.
Last winter I got out bouldering pretty much as often as I would normaly have managed despite the dark. Pick venues where the landings are ok and it's fine with a headtorch. I mark a big chalk X on the pad as an aiming point (makes judging depth easier and helps prevent jarred knees) and all the holds get chalk ticks (they wash off where I climb so no big deal).
jk
In reply to cider nut: My best is E2 but normally in winter its HVS!
As long as you no were your going and are willing to look harder for your gear its a great time.
Now iam 18 i tend to be in the pub by night fall, i really need to get and do some more this winter.
A good alpine exercise!
As long as you no were your going and are willing to look harder for your gear its a great time.
Now iam 18 i tend to be in the pub by night fall, i really need to get and do some more this winter.
A good alpine exercise!
In reply to Chris Harris:
that looks excellent fun.
I lead some sports climbs last year in the dark. Probably a safer more fun option as doesn't take much more consideration than doing it in the light.
that looks excellent fun.
I lead some sports climbs last year in the dark. Probably a safer more fun option as doesn't take much more consideration than doing it in the light.
In reply to cider nut: done it a couple of times the last one was on a route i've done a few times (xmas curry). Nearly full moon and on arrival on the friday night mean finsihing about 1-2 am (what with the drive),, but still well worthwhile!
In reply to Al Evans: Unless you put your legs right out to the side! ANd my waist is a little too large to fit inside the strapd of a headtorch, I'm afraid!
Sam
Sam
In reply to cider nut:
How about another Halloween bloddering fest? :
How about another Halloween bloddering fest? :
In reply to cider nut:
Avon Gorge. Suspension Bridge Buttress. Fully illuminated by spot lights from the bridge.
Avon Gorge. Suspension Bridge Buttress. Fully illuminated by spot lights from the bridge.
In reply to IainRUK:
A friend decided to walk over Beinn Macdui by moonlight. He was navigating fairly carefully (obviously!) when he suddenly looked round and realised he was seeing a temperature inversion by moonlight. He likewise rates it as one of his best hill experiences.
> One of my best memories is being at the back of Tryfan in full moonlight with a temperature inversion. All the peaks sat above the cloud bathed in sunlight. One of the greatest sights I have ever seen.
A friend decided to walk over Beinn Macdui by moonlight. He was navigating fairly carefully (obviously!) when he suddenly looked round and realised he was seeing a temperature inversion by moonlight. He likewise rates it as one of his best hill experiences.
In reply to cider nut:
I used to climb easy slab routes on "my" local crags by moonlight - absolutely wonderful, although you have to watch out for scorpions.
But then one evening I met a bear on the way down and now I'm too scared!
I used to climb easy slab routes on "my" local crags by moonlight - absolutely wonderful, although you have to watch out for scorpions.
But then one evening I met a bear on the way down and now I'm too scared!
In reply to cider nut:
Once the new children have settled down and have been put to bed, I'll be out in the Chew area climbing in the evenings.
Once the new children have settled down and have been put to bed, I'll be out in the Chew area climbing in the evenings.
In reply to cider nut: All you need is a goot head torch, foot work is harder start on easy routes or routes you know.
In reply to cider nut: I've done a bit solo in the winter (where of course the whiteness of the snow helps visibility) but I would always add a little redundancy into the lighting system by strapping a divers torch or two onto the helmet just in case.
I would add (just in case my mother is an internet stalker) that I've pretty much stopped that sort of foolishness now after a rather too vivid bit of imagination one night on the Eas Anie.
I would add (just in case my mother is an internet stalker) that I've pretty much stopped that sort of foolishness now after a rather too vivid bit of imagination one night on the Eas Anie.
In reply to cider nut:
Had our first go at this last night. We'd had a little preparation for it at Aldery cliff the other week, when I seconded a route in the dark. Last night we went to Windgather - somewhere familiar, with easy cracks, just the place to try out night climbing. I led a route in the daylight (well, dusk by the time I finished), then Dan led a route by headtorch. It was quite cold, and we both kept getting numb toes, luckily the rest of us stayed quite warm - we were well prepared at least, I was wearing 6 layers, and Dan was wearing 4 including a thermal and a downy! After the first route we could happily have adjourned to the pub, but I fancied a go too so pushed on and was glad I did as it was quite cool. We both only did VDiffs and Dan's was a one move wonder while mine was overgraded, but you've got to start somewhere!
A couple of things I noticed - bugs! At Aldery, as soon as it got dark woodlice filled the cracks in the rocks and spread out across the faces, so I had to be careful not to crush then while I was climbing. And last night when I was belaying Dan, I noticed earwigs sitting on the rope.
Another thing, but quite an obvious one - if you're placing gear in a corner crack, it's hard to get the head torch at the right angle to check it.
It felt really nice not to be restricted by remaining daylight. Dan and I are quite slow climbers, and normally only fit 1 or 2 routes into an evening session. Last night we did three (and were still in the pub just after 9) - okay, so they were easier routes, but we apart from the cold we could have carried on. It's quite a sense of freedom, and leaves the quandry to when you stop climbing if it's a warm night (I guess last orders would be a good answer to that).
Had our first go at this last night. We'd had a little preparation for it at Aldery cliff the other week, when I seconded a route in the dark. Last night we went to Windgather - somewhere familiar, with easy cracks, just the place to try out night climbing. I led a route in the daylight (well, dusk by the time I finished), then Dan led a route by headtorch. It was quite cold, and we both kept getting numb toes, luckily the rest of us stayed quite warm - we were well prepared at least, I was wearing 6 layers, and Dan was wearing 4 including a thermal and a downy! After the first route we could happily have adjourned to the pub, but I fancied a go too so pushed on and was glad I did as it was quite cool. We both only did VDiffs and Dan's was a one move wonder while mine was overgraded, but you've got to start somewhere!
A couple of things I noticed - bugs! At Aldery, as soon as it got dark woodlice filled the cracks in the rocks and spread out across the faces, so I had to be careful not to crush then while I was climbing. And last night when I was belaying Dan, I noticed earwigs sitting on the rope.
Another thing, but quite an obvious one - if you're placing gear in a corner crack, it's hard to get the head torch at the right angle to check it.
It felt really nice not to be restricted by remaining daylight. Dan and I are quite slow climbers, and normally only fit 1 or 2 routes into an evening session. Last night we did three (and were still in the pub just after 9) - okay, so they were easier routes, but we apart from the cold we could have carried on. It's quite a sense of freedom, and leaves the quandry to when you stop climbing if it's a warm night (I guess last orders would be a good answer to that).
In reply to Chris Tan Ver. L SP2: Took me a while to work out what you meant there!
In reply to cider nut: The best laugh used to be ther routes like 'Our Father' off Windy Ledge by head torch after a session in the Royal Oak in Stoney. That was quite challenging
In reply to cider nut:
When I saw the full moon last night I wondered whether you would be out on the moors!
Did you even need the headtorches - it seem pretty bright
When I saw the full moon last night I wondered whether you would be out on the moors!
Did you even need the headtorches - it seem pretty bright
Did Tryfan Fach at night with a bright moon and no wind, good visibility in the spring. We had a great time!
In reply to cider nut:
It was a good and enjoyable evening - even if it was a little on the cold side. Hopefully future evening may be a little warmer!
It was a good and enjoyable evening - even if it was a little on the cold side. Hopefully future evening may be a little warmer!
In reply to cider nut: Haven't done any 'proper' climbing at night; you know, with gear, ropes etc. But I have done Tower Ridge in the dark (deliberately!), and was on the summit for sunrise. Home in time for breakfast and then work at 8am! One of the best days in the hills ever.
Didn't feel as exposed as when I'd done during the day, and only took a Petzl Micra (it was pre-LED torch days). Have always wanted to do a proper multipitch at night. Maybe I'll get around to it someday.
Didn't feel as exposed as when I'd done during the day, and only took a Petzl Micra (it was pre-LED torch days). Have always wanted to do a proper multipitch at night. Maybe I'll get around to it someday.
In reply to Chris the Tall:
Probably not, but we put them on anyway since we're night climbing virgins and didn't want to get too scared
Probably not, but we put them on anyway since we're night climbing virgins and didn't want to get too scared
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