UKC

I have fairly decent cardio from biking, I ran a half marathon without any training and was fine, except by mile 10 I had quite achy knees.

Do knees condition up and respond to training load, or are they more just genetic luck of the draw?

I'm planning on running a marathon in October but I would like to build my mileage up slowly so I can push for a good time rather than just hobbling round. If I build up my mileage slowly will this protect my joints...also does anyone include any stretches to help or supplements?

Muscles and cardio I have no problems

In reply to Kemics:

theyll probably get used to it however.. it helps to have good form and foot position. Useful to have a partner check this for you or even video you running. Taking long strides puts more stress on your knees as does having your feet turn outward too much, or having flat arches.

Stretching is a fairly personal thing, I stretch gently after a run, usually my hamstrings groin and quads but just have a go at stretching different muscles and feel which ones feel stiff or tight.

In reply to Kemics:

I am probably much older than you, so I don't know if this will be of any help, but about 10 years ago a friend (a PE teacher and keen hockey player) recommended glucosamine tablets. I was an active (but not very succesful) hill runner and years of that and carrying big rucsacs on the hill when climbing meant that I began to get a really sore left knee during and after running. She swore by the tablets, and I have been taking them since and have had no more problems. This being UKclimbing, someone will no doubt severely lambast me for suggesting them, but they have worked for me. They did take about 8 weeks to be effective, but hey ho, they may be worth a try.

In reply to Kemics:

Yes they will condition. Or at least they should

In reply to ow arm:


Hmm I do both of these so that's not a good sign, good news I suppose I can work on it

In reply to pamph:


I wouldn't go as far as lambasting you, but the evidence for suggesting it does anything beneficial is shaky at best, and generally considered to be no better than a placebo. And I'm married to someone who makes her living by selling, among other things, a huge percentage of the global glucosamine supply (or at least the crushed shrimp shells that make it).

I trail run regularly, around 2000km per year for the last 8 years or so and have never had knee problems apart from the odd bit of ITB pain in the early years. Not sure if I've been lucky, but I found it took 2-3 years for the real bio-mechanical changes to kick in as a result of serious running. I think people tend to get fitter more quickly than it takes for muscleo-skeletal changes to happen and end up causing themselves injury by going too far too early.

In reply to yorkshireman:

Totally agree - that has been my experience with my own body. Injury is also just around the corner if I increase mileage too quickly, do too many intensive sessions (speedwork, hills), even increasing the frequency of runs (e.g. 2 shorter runs in one day) without adding mileage and not stretching calves/hamstrings post-run religiously! After a while (years!) you learn what works for you and how to manage your body.

Incidentally I've just been trying to change my running style so I don't land so heavily on my heels and, whilst I now have sore calves from more running forefoot first, I have reduced ankle, hip, groin and lower back pain! Good result although I'm still getting used to it and not doing it all the time yet. Not saying OP should do this, but definitely a good idea to analyse your running style or get help from someone who can look at it for you.

In reply to yorkshireman:

Yes, I understand that there is no definitive evidence that they work. For me they do, and about three years ago when off work for 8 months with a ruptured disc I stopped taking them. My pill intake for the spinal injury pain was exceeding 20 a day, and I felt that as I was no longer running (or doing anything, to be honest apart from feeling sorry for myself!) that I didn't need them. Within about two months my left knee began to seriously hurt, and even walking up the stairs was getting very painful, so I started the glucosamine again, and the pain eventually went. So either they work, or I am very susceptable to placebos! I still take them as even though I can't run now, I have lots of steps to climb when off-shore. And probably helping to pay your wife's wages!

In reply to pamph:


Not a lambasting, but I seem to remember reading somewhere that taking glucosamine was implicated in speeding up the development of tendon cysts in those with a predisposition to Duptreyn's Contracture

In reply to Kemics:

I had problems with my knees as a teenager and often when running intermittently in my 20s and early 30s. I have been running much more seriously for the last 5 years (40-60 miles a week) and have not had any knee problems since.

In my case at least, running more got rid of the problem.

In reply to Kemics:
i'm thinking that more might be the answer here. You have the muscles and cardio from cycling, but the range of motion is entirely different, as is the impact. The muscle from cycling may even be a hindrance here.

And by mile 10 of a 1/2, yes, sore knees are not so odd

In reply to Kemics:

Hi (sorry about your ps, btw - hope you got in!)

When I last began to run frequently 3 years ago, my BMI was 27 something. It is now 22 something. I initially mixed running with swimming and cycling, and didn't time anything. It hurt, every time, especially in my arse! When I got to 20 miles per week, I then increased it over the next year to about 50 miles a week, and after that concentrated on just running, with much of it off road, and with most runs being 8 miles or more. I have done about 5000 miles and a lot (>400,000 ft) of ascent in the last two years. Apart from one debilitating bout of plantar fasciitis, I haven't had any injuries that I am aware of. My legs ache after a long run, but not for long and I often run 8-10 miles, 6 days a week without issue. I never do any stretching, before or after, and never take supplements. I just get out. My guess, which is all it is, is that my body will adapt through constant use.

In reply to Kemics:

I used to get injured as soon as I got past 25 mpw or so. Three things that worked for me: The trigger point therapy work book - it's on Amazon and the best few £ you could spend (save a fair bit in physio fees too). Mobilitywod.com - it's now a pay site, but you can search back through the 400 or so videos that are free from when it first started. Changing running style - did the whole barefoot / chi running / pose running minimal thing and learnt to run again. Still get tweaks from time to time but seem to be able to sort them before anything goes too wrong.