UKC

Sad news. Dougie died a couple of days ago.

https://www.facebook.com/thisisleekstaffordshire/photos/a.101296779018663/1...

Met him a few times. Not everyone's cup of tea, but few are. Certainly added another chapter to the  Roaches history.

Sad news. The mad axe man. A true character. Didn’t he help you out once @philB1950?

I remember him being interested in what folks were up to. He knew the names of all the routes and would offer to sign your guidebook. 

A total character. Perhaps appropriately, he gave me some well dodgy beta for Piece of Mind.

Swing your axe in the sky, Dougie! Keep on fighting the good fight. 

Mick 

Would have loved to have met him.

A great character. Not everyone's cup of tea, but I always found him friendly and helpful.

Was introduced to Dougie when with my Dad when I was a kid when we visited the Roaches. Seemed a formidable man with a ready smile. RIP.

Offer to sign your guidebook? He ripped mine out of my hand and wrote in it before I could stop him. As he had a shotgun tucked under his arm I thought best not to argue. It now feels like a piece of wonderful history. 

He was always helpful - telling me where to put my foot on the hidden hold on Valkyrie as I wobbled across on lead - and ready for a chat even if he was a bit intimidating.

RIP Doug

I was in Leek today and heard about Doug....a character, a small piece of history but unlikely we will see many characters like Doug again. Like others I had a number of chats with Doug....we had a common thing both being from Liverpool. Until about maybe 8 years ago I'd see him in Leek occasionally but I think he was housed somewhere else round about then.

Part of the Staffs Moorland scene for sure and whoever decided to put his photo in the guidebook it was a great move....to be appreciated even more now.

RIP Doug

I suspect you and he would have got on like the proverbial house on fire. 

He had a good heart. 

Mick 

He was quite an aggressive character when I first encountered him  probably in the mid '70s, but he mellowed over the years and became a Roaches legend. RIP Dougie!

Dougie was quite a complex character and once over a cup of tea in Rock Cottage he explained that when he and Annie bought the cottage it was as an escape from the everyday world. They’d first visited in winter, not realising the area was a honeypot must visit destination and hence his initial aggression. He also probably saved my life, when soloing Elegy I hadn’t realised the top delicate last few moves where green and wet. Made one upward move too many and started to slide, but I couldn’t reverse for the same reason. I’d started contemplating a fall out zone, when I spotted and shouted to Dougie, who ran round to the top and lowered me the end oh his wood bundle rope. One quick pull and I was up, so thank you Dougie! At the top I thanked him profusely and he replied “Any time Ron”. Ron and myself both lived in Buxton at the time and so climbed there a lot, sometimes soloing together and Dougie often mixed us up.

I first met in in the late 80's. He claimed we were throwing stones down his chimney. we weren't. But he mellowed and stopped an chatted. I met him again a few decades later and he went off on some bizarre conversation about mercenaries. How to select your nom de geure. You have two lawyers, one only knows the other, the second knows your next of kin. You give you first layer as you next of kin, he can forward details to the second, who will inform your family. I think the conversation initially start about the weather!

Edit to add: He said he'd never been paid by BMC for Rockhall cottage. I dont know if this is true or not.

RIP

A fascinating and much misunderstood man; chatted with him (and Annie) over many cups of tea over the years. I think many of us would be equally "touchy" living under such a popular crag, we (climbers) aren't always the best neighbors.

RIP Your Majesty.

I don't think people realised how badly he was scammed - as you say, he was looking for peace and quiet for his wife, who was troubled, and was shown the place in the depths of winter.  Noisy, boisterous climbers were not mentioned.

I only met him once, I was climbing with Jonny Woodward on an unprotected arete (Dorothy's Dilemma, maybe? ) when Dougie appeared. Jonny was understandably concerned that a fracas MIGHT result in an unwelcome tug on the rope, so shot up; in the event Dougie was friendly and happy to see us. RIP.

R.I.P Doug. In the early 80's he threatened to throw an axe at me if I didn't finish Via Dolorosa (there was ice on some of the upper holds). Once back at ground level he was very friendly and chatted with me and my mates for a while. 

Thank you all. I was a little concerned some might not want to celebrate Dougie's life.  I was scared by a number of things in my youth, but Dougie wasn't one of them. Like Terry's Festerhaunt and getting thrown out of Eric's Barn in Tremadog, having tea and Battenburg cake with Dougie and his wife was part of my climbing education. 

An obit:

https://www.stokesentinel.co.uk/news/stoke-on-trent-news/tributes-paid-doug...

An interesting old article on Dougie:

https://ludchurchmyblog.wordpress.com/places-of-other-local-interest/doug-m...

I tried to find links to get copies of his book but failed. Leek Library supposedly has it.

https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/1501518.The_Wars_of_the_Roaches

Thanks for posting those articles. A couple of years ago I was talking to a neighbour. We both live on farms and we got to talking about "Characters" in the countryside and how most of them have now died. One "character" who lived down the road used to make much of his living from poaching. In the old days, you could get 30 shillings for selling a rabbit to a butcher. This was when wages were about £30 per week.

I have fond memories of meeting Dougie between the ages of 5 & 8 years old in the late 80s. I’m aware that his reputation preceded him but he & his wife were always very nice to my younger sister & I, & friendly to my self-professed gritstone-bimbler parents. In my mind’s eye, I can still see Dougie in ‘89 at the crag flanked, biker-esque, by a bunch of very muscular blokes clad all in black. 
 

RIP Dougie. 

I remember Dougie (on more than one occasion) telling me to get on with it and stop dithering about (can't remember his actual words) when I was puntering up some route or other - never met his wife, I think she was already unable to be out and about by then.

He made the Roaches a much more characterful place. 

Back in the late 80's . I had gone up the Roaches one winter morning. The fog was thick so decided to walk up to the Skyline. On the way up the steps I heard this weird noise. I was quite spooked. I couldn't see anything. It was coming from the vicinity past the left end of the lower tier. I drifted towards the noise but still couldn't see anything. It was getting louder. So I stopped almost frozen in panic. Then after a few minutes the fog dissolved ever so slightly and I could see Doug 30ft up one of the larch trees hacking off a limb. God knows how he got up there. I sneaked off quietly hoping he wouldn't see me. 

How did he get down with a limb missing?😂

He was probably pulling his leg?

I was climbing on the upper tier when Dougie ran riot on the lower tier with his axe.

Is there anyone on here who was present at that time on the lower tier who can accurately describe what happened.

John Gresty

I can't help but think that some people on here are seeing him through rose tinted glasses.  That or there are two Dougies. I recall him waving a large axe around and threatening to use it on climbers. It's difficult to see how anyone can find that endearing or amusing. We were terrified and honestly thought we were dealing with a maniac and that our lives were at risk.  Needless to say we left.

Possibly. Never encountered him myself, but Mike and Ron's posts upthread seem to indicate a much more complex situation.

There probably were two Dougies. I suspect most people never experienced the mad one though. I certainly never saw anything frightening on the maybe half dozen times he spoke to us over the years. 

As I posted earlier, I was climbing on the upper tier when I heard a real commotion on the lower tier. 

A few minutes later several police cars and police motorcycles arrived, the motorcycles even rode up the track to the cottage. Several minutes later I saw Dougie and several climbers being escorted down to the police vehicles.

I have been told secondhand what occurred but would prefer if someone actually present could relate the story. 

The aftermath of this incident resulted in negociations, of which I again have only secondhand information but believe the climbing community can be proud of, resulted in an agreement  which calmed the situation.

Years later I bumped into Dougie several times at the crag, after he had moved out, and he had become the pleasant character recalled on here by some people.

The cottage, prior to this incident was surrounded by wire on which were fixed  multiple dire warning, a very scary place. Lots of stories abounded, Dougie chopping down trees, removing most of the woodwork in the cottage to to burn, his wife berating people for polluting the spring, 

John

I believe Eugene's Axe on Roaches Lower Tier was a reference to Dougies  axe wieding phase. "Careful with that axe, Eugene" by Pink Floyd.

Loris

I bought his book a good few years ago when it was published. It quickly went in the bin as it was so bad.

Its not to say he did not lead an interesting life, but it was full of stories which were I suspect made up for print from what I recall.

Yep, deeply unpleasant. Avoided the Roaches at the time as it was that bad.Mates had run ins with him.

I started climbing at the Roaches around 1982 I reckon, but, I can say he was always alright with us but we were a group of lads from Liverpool and pretty confident with any trouble coming our way.....Doug told us he was from Liverpool and we were immediately welcomed by him although there were tales around at the time of him threatening people, especially on the bottom end of the lower tier bear the cottage. Some folk used to walk the long way round or come over the moor to avoid any contact with him!

I must have caught him on a bad day, when encouraged me to leave one day with said shotgun. I must say he was absolutely fine with me on all subsequent visits. Didn't offer to sign my guidebook though...

I experienced both the shotgun and the axe but in later years he became more of a nuisance than a danger.  I would be interested to know what brought about the dramatic change.

I think we can all agree he did leave an impression of one sort or another.

It seems that he discovered that his 'get away from it all' home was anything of the sort. And then I think his wife's health declined. My guess (and it is just a guess) is that he felt he'd been sold a pup and had been pushed into a corner. In his mind, things probably got worse and worse and then... he lost it. 

But he wasn't a stupid man (far from it) and he must have known he was lucky not to get a custodial sentence. His wife may well have remonstrated with him. And he probably realised that climbers (certainly then) were often similarly anti-establishment types. Even if they weren't, they were still well meaning and essentially harmless. Maybe he came to his senses and started to enjoy the company and the banter? 

All conjecture, I freely accept. But clearly something happened. Perhaps I've been fortunate but I have only good memories of him. 

Mick 

My recollection - I think from the man himself -was that he knew he had been sold a pup - he was looking for peace and quiet,  in the middle of winter the Roaches seemed to offer it, and he was then (understandably) enraged when we all turned up in the Spring. And I don't  suppose any climber, not knowing the backstory, would have been overly sympathetic.

As I've said, I met him in 1979... it was initially a bit edgy, but he was fine. Did anyone ever actually suffer harm?

It's a tough world, some people find it harder to negotiate than others. RIP Doug, I've got nothing but fond memories.

That's right

No doubt everyone on this thread who say what a great guy he was would just love to meet someone on the path below Cloggy, or the path up to Grochan, waving an axe or a gun around in a threatening way. Wouldn't that be fun

I knew him from when he first moved in to when he left. Sure there were signs posted threatening dire consequences but they were just pure theatre along with some of his antics. He sometimes used to raise his eyepatch to get a better view of you and he loved his fame as lord of the roaches. He always carried his axe to chop wood and create a fierce appearance and he did get in trouble with the Peak Park for bark ringing trees, but anyone who dislikes the Peak Park gets my vote and I used to work for them.

Look out for trolls under bridges on the way up to Cloggy. Very dangerous!

Very funny.  Climbers stood in front of someone with a crazed, manic look in their eyes, pointing a loaded double barrel shot gun at them, screaming  or waving a large axe around and you are questioning their negotiating skills.  You are joking aren't you?

In the early days he did seem quite hostile and there were warning signs all around the cottage. If you bumped into him he could be intimidating if not actually threatening. But as time went on he seemed to mellow. I'd heard it began when the authorities were trying to get him out and the climbing community supported him.

I didn't meet him until the 1980's. To me, he was just some somewhat eccentric guy. He often told me that "Insert climber's name here" had recently climbed route "Insert route name here". He was carrying his axe, but I never felt threatened by him.

A few tales to add re Doug. Both were with the recently deceased Andy Moss.

Firstly I was struggling on Elegy near the top of the slab. Too much lichen and this in the waist belay no friends era. Doug bursts out of the cottage axe in one hand, tranny radio in the other, ranting and raving around Andy as he belayed. Turns out Doug was upset by the radio reporting the Heysel stadium disaster. Gave me the motivation to finish the route though!

Secondly the stone throwing issue. Behind the cottage below Chalkstorm one time when stones were thrown from the top at the cottage roof. Gave chase after 2 teenagers but they got away. Described them to a local guy later who thought he knew them. Said he would "deal with them". Hope he did so firmly.

Isn't it a measure of a good, civilized society that we find room for eccentrics and oddballs?

RIP Doug. It was more fun visiting the crag when you were there than when you weren't.

By all means let him RIP but please do not laud him.  This is quite nauseating to anyone who was on the receiving end of his threats and demonstrates a considerable lack of empathy.

It's a worry that so many on this forum consider pointing a cocked and loaded gun at someone with the finger on the trigger as simply "theatre" and "eccentric".

Climbers stood in front of someone with a crazed, manic look in their eyes, pointing a loaded double barrel shot gun at them, screaming  or waving a large axe around and you are questioning their negotiating skills.  You are joking aren't you?

Depends where you climb, I find.  On the other hand I do think for a while Dougie's mental health wasn't all we would have liked it to be.  Could be there's a need for empathy all round. Maybe time to bury the hatchet. The only person dead is Doug.

You lost me. What does "depends where you climb" mean?  We are talking about the Roaches.

Happy to both let him RIP and 'laud' him though I think it's people just recalling fond memories rather than lauding him. why shouldn't I? .  Your experiences were different and not good, fair enough but so what. Not aware he actually harmed anyone?   

Chatted to him a few times and had a brew with him after he signed my shiny new '89 guide . 

And he saved Phil Burke-Fawcett's life! 

RIP Doug

Oh well if we are only talking the Roaches, we might mention the story of Don Whillans holding a gamekeeper over the edge of Sloth and explaining how he would prefer not be harrassed whilst climbing, various attacks on Protestants in Lud Church and the mystery of the fighting wallabies. Maybe it's something in the water.

Personally various violent acts have been carried out or threatened whilst I've been climbing over the years. I've rarely felt the need for revenge but often the need to understand better.

It's the need to understand better which will enable us to progress. 

Mick 

So what? He could have quite easily killed us, that's so what.  Even if that was not his intention all that needed to happen was for him to trip or even hicup. It's a forum for discussion.  I'm discussing that's also so what.

Are you seriously suggesting that this type of behaviour is not an issue as long as no one is actually hurt?

Was, not is.  It was getting on for 40 years ago.    

Acknowledged but the discussion is now.