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The Coldest Crossing
http://mpora.com/articles/british-students-received-death-threats-failed-ad...
and
http://www.isalp.is/forums/topic/the-coldest-crossing-a-few-thoughts
Interesting stuff...
http://mpora.com/articles/british-students-received-death-threats-failed-ad...
and
http://www.isalp.is/forums/topic/the-coldest-crossing-a-few-thoughts
Interesting stuff...
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In reply to buffalo606:
This is probably not going to sit well on this forum but in my opinion if you are trying a challenge like that regardless of experience you should have insurance to cover the cost of rescue.
Not for day to day mountaineering things where it hits the fan and mountain rescue comes out but if the challenge is as severe as the article makes out there is a high chance of being rescued and that should be paid for.
This is probably not going to sit well on this forum but in my opinion if you are trying a challenge like that regardless of experience you should have insurance to cover the cost of rescue.
Not for day to day mountaineering things where it hits the fan and mountain rescue comes out but if the challenge is as severe as the article makes out there is a high chance of being rescued and that should be paid for.
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In reply to buffalo606:
Feel a bit sorry for them. It's clearly been turned into a bit of a political football.
I suppose the down side to trying to generate media attention when undertaking these types of challenges is, when it hits the fan, you look a bit silly.
Feel a bit sorry for them. It's clearly been turned into a bit of a political football.
I suppose the down side to trying to generate media attention when undertaking these types of challenges is, when it hits the fan, you look a bit silly.
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In reply to buffalo606:
"I thought Coldest Crossing was a boy band developed by @beargrylls" Andy Kirkpatrick
Just about sums it up really.
"I thought Coldest Crossing was a boy band developed by @beargrylls" Andy Kirkpatrick
Just about sums it up really.
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In reply to buffalo606:
Nevermind the tourists, this pic made my day! http://www.isalp.is/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/TCC02.jpg
Nevermind the tourists, this pic made my day! http://www.isalp.is/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/TCC02.jpg
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In reply to buffalo606:
" ICE-SAR project manager Guðbrandur Örn Arnarson reiterated this in a report on the mission: “To be absolutely clear the team was not irrisponsible [sic] and poorly equipped.” "
" ICE-SAR project manager Guðbrandur Örn Arnarson reiterated this in a report on the mission: “To be absolutely clear the team was not irrisponsible [sic] and poorly equipped.” "
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In reply to buffalo606:
Some interesting links.
I've read a lot about this expedition and I have very mixed feelings. I think its easy to criticise their naive attitude and approach, given the scale of the undertaking and their lack of relevant (or any) expedition experience. But I feel like they were quite genuine in what they believed they were doing and probably didn't set out to deceive anyone. Unfortunately, this might not quite have been the best choice of expedition objective for the group. The conversations about S&R costs in Iceland were also quite interesting and seem to mirror those that we have here. I don't have very much experience, but Iceland are the first country I've come across with an entirely voluntary mountain rescue service like our own?
Ultimately I think that most of all they are quite young and with time will come to learn that the best way to gain respect and support for your endeavour is through humility and understatement. It won't generate short-term social media interest but will make for a better long term outcome.
Final thought - fair play to them for somehow persuading Renan and Taylor Rees to join them!
George
Some interesting links.
I've read a lot about this expedition and I have very mixed feelings. I think its easy to criticise their naive attitude and approach, given the scale of the undertaking and their lack of relevant (or any) expedition experience. But I feel like they were quite genuine in what they believed they were doing and probably didn't set out to deceive anyone. Unfortunately, this might not quite have been the best choice of expedition objective for the group. The conversations about S&R costs in Iceland were also quite interesting and seem to mirror those that we have here. I don't have very much experience, but Iceland are the first country I've come across with an entirely voluntary mountain rescue service like our own?
Ultimately I think that most of all they are quite young and with time will come to learn that the best way to gain respect and support for your endeavour is through humility and understatement. It won't generate short-term social media interest but will make for a better long term outcome.
Final thought - fair play to them for somehow persuading Renan and Taylor Rees to join them!
George
Post edited at 20:09
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In reply to JJL:
Should have received a death threat for that IMHO.
Caveat for the boring crowd: I'm in no way suggesting that someone's life should be threatened for poor grammar, this is comment is made with tounge firmly in cheek.
> He lost me at "would of been"
Should have received a death threat for that IMHO.
Caveat for the boring crowd: I'm in no way suggesting that someone's life should be threatened for poor grammar, this is comment is made with tounge firmly in cheek.
Post edited at 21:50
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In reply to ianstevens:
You are to be commended for speaking at all with anything as deformed as a tounge ...
You are to be commended for speaking at all with anything as deformed as a tounge ...
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In reply to Gordon Stainforth:
Looks like I'll be sending myself a death threat as well. Complete with awful spelling.
Looks like I'll be sending myself a death threat as well. Complete with awful spelling.
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In reply to buffalo606:
Belgian adventurer Louis-Phillip Loncke, crossed Iceland back in the summer of 2010 but has yet to cross the island in winter.
“I would put summiting Mt. Everest at a 5 [10 being the hardest], traversing Antarctica at a 6, and crossing Iceland in winter at a 9.5
seems unlikely.
the accounts not winning me over so far.
Belgian adventurer Louis-Phillip Loncke, crossed Iceland back in the summer of 2010 but has yet to cross the island in winter.
“I would put summiting Mt. Everest at a 5 [10 being the hardest], traversing Antarctica at a 6, and crossing Iceland in winter at a 9.5
seems unlikely.
the accounts not winning me over so far.
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In reply to purplemonkeyelephant:
from the second link:
Could have been better
– They should not claim things that aren’t true
– – It’s not like information isn’t available. A single e-mail to the Icelandic Alpine club or a forum post would have cleared that up.
...
– – Start with achievable goals. Learn from your mistakes.
– – Being assisted four times on the same trip is a pretty blunt indication that you were way out of your depth.
interesting article.
hope their next trip is more successful, and we all learn from experience. if the second article is true though, there's been a degree of editing out relevant parts of the story that doesnt show them in the best of lights.
from the second link:
Could have been better
– They should not claim things that aren’t true
– – It’s not like information isn’t available. A single e-mail to the Icelandic Alpine club or a forum post would have cleared that up.
...
– – Start with achievable goals. Learn from your mistakes.
– – Being assisted four times on the same trip is a pretty blunt indication that you were way out of your depth.
interesting article.
hope their next trip is more successful, and we all learn from experience. if the second article is true though, there's been a degree of editing out relevant parts of the story that doesnt show them in the best of lights.
In reply to buffalo606:
To paraphrase oscar Wilde - to be rescued once may be regarded as a misfortune, to be rescued twice is carelessness.
With a trip like this, where self-sufficiency is key, you shouldn't need to be rescued. But sometimes the unexpected happens. Even so, once you've had to call out rescue once, it's a good indication that you're out of your depth, time to call it off. A second call-out is definitely the end, and to press on until you make a third is pretty inexcusable.
Having said that, U.K. Politicians frequently get on their soap box when people call out MR in this country, regardless of what the volunteers themselves have to say.
To paraphrase oscar Wilde - to be rescued once may be regarded as a misfortune, to be rescued twice is carelessness.
With a trip like this, where self-sufficiency is key, you shouldn't need to be rescued. But sometimes the unexpected happens. Even so, once you've had to call out rescue once, it's a good indication that you're out of your depth, time to call it off. A second call-out is definitely the end, and to press on until you make a third is pretty inexcusable.
Having said that, U.K. Politicians frequently get on their soap box when people call out MR in this country, regardless of what the volunteers themselves have to say.
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In reply to no_more_scotch_eggs:
Could it be less successful?* As for learning from experience, they still seem to be in denial "...done lots of one to two week long expeditions in the UK." In pre-expedition PR guff by ones so young that would be (unfortunately) acceptable, but after this fact they should have had a sufficient reality check to know that marathons, skiing and other non-expedition trips are clearly not enough. It's all a bit 'gap yah' and has been widely pilloried as such.
>> if the second article is true though, there's been a degree of editing out relevant parts of the story that doesnt show them in the best of lights.
They're British. They've learnt from the masters - Ran Fiennes, Bear Grylls. You should be proud of them.
*Yes, a death. But that would turn it from unsuccessful to tragedy, which no one would wish for.
> hope their next trip is more successful, and we all learn from experience.
Could it be less successful?* As for learning from experience, they still seem to be in denial "...done lots of one to two week long expeditions in the UK." In pre-expedition PR guff by ones so young that would be (unfortunately) acceptable, but after this fact they should have had a sufficient reality check to know that marathons, skiing and other non-expedition trips are clearly not enough. It's all a bit 'gap yah' and has been widely pilloried as such.
>> if the second article is true though, there's been a degree of editing out relevant parts of the story that doesnt show them in the best of lights.
They're British. They've learnt from the masters - Ran Fiennes, Bear Grylls. You should be proud of them.
*Yes, a death. But that would turn it from unsuccessful to tragedy, which no one would wish for.
Post edited at 06:01
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In reply to Damo:
Are there many hotels in the interior of Iceland?
> They're British. They've learnt from the masters - Ran Fiennes, Bear Grylls. You should be proud of them
Are there many hotels in the interior of Iceland?
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In reply to buffalo606:
Struggling to find anything positive, would Dunning-Kruger excuse them?
> 1) People wondered why the guys were using what appeared to be semi stiff carbon boots and randonee skis. This is very unconventional for horizontal skiing for long distances.
> Q: “...why did you decide on alpine skis rather than nordic skis? “
> A: “It’s mainly so we can ‘enjoy’ the mountain section for the last part of the expedition – we have gone for ultra light ATOMIC SKIING touring skis which will allow us the flexibility of both”
> Icelanders ski this mountain section in spring, the climb is 2-3 hours and the skiing is at most half an hour. Seems excessive to cross Iceland on Alpine skis just to get in some good 10 turns. With pulkas.
> Q: “...why did you decide on alpine skis rather than nordic skis? “
> A: “It’s mainly so we can ‘enjoy’ the mountain section for the last part of the expedition – we have gone for ultra light ATOMIC SKIING touring skis which will allow us the flexibility of both”
> Icelanders ski this mountain section in spring, the climb is 2-3 hours and the skiing is at most half an hour. Seems excessive to cross Iceland on Alpine skis just to get in some good 10 turns. With pulkas.
Struggling to find anything positive, would Dunning-Kruger excuse them?
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In reply to buffalo606:
I also read that their car got stuck on the way to the start and they needed rescuing because of that. Mr Bean would have been more successful.
I also read that their car got stuck on the way to the start and they needed rescuing because of that. Mr Bean would have been more successful.
Post edited at 16:36
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Having been to Iceland and met many Icelandic people i found them list most Nordic people to be incredibly welcoming, helpful and generous i find it incredibly impressive that 5 school boys have managed to piss of that entire country (all be less than the population of Sheffield) so well.
Although i don't agree with them having to pay for their "rescue" just as our mountain rescue don't charge you would think after they had to call in a chopper the 2nd time they would call it quits.
Although i don't agree with them having to pay for their "rescue" just as our mountain rescue don't charge you would think after they had to call in a chopper the 2nd time they would call it quits.
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In reply to buffalo606:
Their promo video seemed it a bit hopeful, but this tends to be plummy cock territory, seemed to remember there was a kickstarter type element to it. Who amonsgt us has never enjoyed a catastrophic failure and lived to be a better man/woman/person? Not a Grylls hater, best wishes on future endeavours Lads.
D
Their promo video seemed it a bit hopeful, but this tends to be plummy cock territory, seemed to remember there was a kickstarter type element to it. Who amonsgt us has never enjoyed a catastrophic failure and lived to be a better man/woman/person? Not a Grylls hater, best wishes on future endeavours Lads.
D
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In reply to buffalo606:
What goes around comes around. A group of six year old Icelandic schoolchildren, currently completing the Pennine Way have been assisted by a Border Collie out of Kirk Yetholm. They have dismissed claims of being under prepared stating 'no one wears shoes back home anyway' and 'one sleeping bag was plenty'.
They have not been charged for the assistance offered by Black Bob.
What goes around comes around. A group of six year old Icelandic schoolchildren, currently completing the Pennine Way have been assisted by a Border Collie out of Kirk Yetholm. They have dismissed claims of being under prepared stating 'no one wears shoes back home anyway' and 'one sleeping bag was plenty'.
They have not been charged for the assistance offered by Black Bob.
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In reply to buffalo606:
They strike me as being more interested in being 'famous' and making some career in this field than in any actual adventure.
Desperate narcissists.
They strike me as being more interested in being 'famous' and making some career in this field than in any actual adventure.
Desperate narcissists.
Post edited at 18:45
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In reply to buffalo606:
Most Icelandic folk have not forgotten the cod wars in my experience. A bit like scousers and the Germans bombing their chippies!
Most Icelandic folk have not forgotten the cod wars in my experience. A bit like scousers and the Germans bombing their chippies!
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In reply to Dave the Rave:
Or us invading during WW2, presumably. Or using 'terrorism' legislation to freeze Icelandic-controlled assets...
Or us invading during WW2, presumably. Or using 'terrorism' legislation to freeze Icelandic-controlled assets...
In reply to buffalo606:
I'm surprised the press forgot to mention that they weren't wearing helmets.
I'm surprised the press forgot to mention that they weren't wearing helmets.
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In reply to buffalo606:
"Smith insists the team had enough experience in places like Russia and Africa to take on a mission of this kind."
Africa!?!?!?! What on Earth could Africa give you in the way of experience for crossing Iceland in winter? (serious question)
"Smith insists the team had enough experience in places like Russia and Africa to take on a mission of this kind."
Africa!?!?!?! What on Earth could Africa give you in the way of experience for crossing Iceland in winter? (serious question)
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In reply to buffalo606:
I remember reading about this and at the time I couldn't work out whether they were exaggerating the level of commitment/adventure/danger or whether they were woefully underprepared/inexperienced. Seems like the latter.
When Iceland agree to payback the £2.35 billion the UK govt stumped up after Iceland reneged on their Depositors' and Investors' Guarantee Fund we can start talking about paying for this rescue!
I remember reading about this and at the time I couldn't work out whether they were exaggerating the level of commitment/adventure/danger or whether they were woefully underprepared/inexperienced. Seems like the latter.
When Iceland agree to payback the £2.35 billion the UK govt stumped up after Iceland reneged on their Depositors' and Investors' Guarantee Fund we can start talking about paying for this rescue!
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In reply to SenzuBean:
Well I've been nearly frozen several times in the Alps, on bivouacs both planned and not, but the coldest I have ever been in my life was on Mount Kenya, my shit was freezing as it left me!
> "Smith insists the team had enough experience in places like Russia and Africa to take on a mission of this kind."
> Africa!?!?!?! What on Earth could Africa give you in the way of experience for crossing Iceland in winter? (serious question)
Well I've been nearly frozen several times in the Alps, on bivouacs both planned and not, but the coldest I have ever been in my life was on Mount Kenya, my shit was freezing as it left me!
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In reply to beh:
It might explain it but not excuse it. I expect it's becoming ever more prevalent as Facebook and Twitter are increasingly stuffed with pursue your dreams, if you can dream it you can do it, the only limiting factor is your mind etc. bollocks. Most of these challenges are fairly benign but hyped to buggery, it seems these twerps were naive enough to pick something that was genuinely difficult!
> would Dunning-Kruger excuse them?
It might explain it but not excuse it. I expect it's becoming ever more prevalent as Facebook and Twitter are increasingly stuffed with pursue your dreams, if you can dream it you can do it, the only limiting factor is your mind etc. bollocks. Most of these challenges are fairly benign but hyped to buggery, it seems these twerps were naive enough to pick something that was genuinely difficult!
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In reply to buffalo606:
I took a look at their website.
Uggggg! Private schoolboys with more money than sense.
A quote from 04:52 of Pilot Film on the website.
"The Coldest Crossing is my personal chance to get a blistering face, blistering toes, possibly get frostbite, eyes that might freeze over and teeth that might fall out "
Good to have an objective for the expedition!
I took a look at their website.
Uggggg! Private schoolboys with more money than sense.
A quote from 04:52 of Pilot Film on the website.
"The Coldest Crossing is my personal chance to get a blistering face, blistering toes, possibly get frostbite, eyes that might freeze over and teeth that might fall out "
Good to have an objective for the expedition!
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In reply to SenzuBean:
Serious answer...
Something in Africa could have taught them the thinking skills to be good at planning, preparation, self-reliance and judgement.
Sounds like they lacked those generic thinking skills that would have made sure they were specifically ready for Iceland.
Serious answer...
Something in Africa could have taught them the thinking skills to be good at planning, preparation, self-reliance and judgement.
Sounds like they lacked those generic thinking skills that would have made sure they were specifically ready for Iceland.
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In reply to buffalo606:
I've been following this story reasonably closely and have chatted with one of the people involved in the Icelandic search and rescue organization. He made a very interesting comment: he could see a younger version of himself in the team members' eyes. I've also thought about climbs that I, and others, did in our youth and got away with, more by luck than judgement.
But having failed to understand the nature of the beast and bitten off way more than they - or most people - could chew, these guys don't seem to be able to admit that they might have anything to learn. That's worrying.
They also seem to have under-researched their trip, been too ready to believe their own hype and to have been surrounded by some very pushy people, keen for them to make names for themselves whilst disregarding the fact that there was a real risk that something could have gone very seriously wrong.
I've been following this story reasonably closely and have chatted with one of the people involved in the Icelandic search and rescue organization. He made a very interesting comment: he could see a younger version of himself in the team members' eyes. I've also thought about climbs that I, and others, did in our youth and got away with, more by luck than judgement.
But having failed to understand the nature of the beast and bitten off way more than they - or most people - could chew, these guys don't seem to be able to admit that they might have anything to learn. That's worrying.
They also seem to have under-researched their trip, been too ready to believe their own hype and to have been surrounded by some very pushy people, keen for them to make names for themselves whilst disregarding the fact that there was a real risk that something could have gone very seriously wrong.
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In reply to elsewhere:
Yeah I know you could learn those in Africa. But you can learn about planning, preparation and self-reliance and judgement _anywhere_ though - e.g. prison, high school exams, getting your driving licence. My point was more that if they mentioned Africa as their "first line of experience" - then it's likely they were considerably lacking in _relevant_ experience. A bit like applying to be a senior civil engineer and saying you helped build a pergola once.
> Serious answer...
> Something in Africa could have taught them the thinking skills to be good at planning, preparation, self-reliance and judgement.
> Sounds like they lacked those generic thinking skills that would have made sure they were specifically ready for Iceland.
Yeah I know you could learn those in Africa. But you can learn about planning, preparation and self-reliance and judgement _anywhere_ though - e.g. prison, high school exams, getting your driving licence. My point was more that if they mentioned Africa as their "first line of experience" - then it's likely they were considerably lacking in _relevant_ experience. A bit like applying to be a senior civil engineer and saying you helped build a pergola once.
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In reply to ogreville:
Maybe it's just me, but if the most important part of your bio is which public school you went to, then something is lacking...
That second link at the top is spot on - although I'm not sure it's narcissism so much as wanting to carry on this tradition of British expeditioning, without really understanding what that entails. To quote that Andy Kirkpatrick post:
"Don’t believe the myths others have sewn about Antarctica, foolish macho heroism, or believe yourself tougher than the rest, that you are Shackleton, Scott or Douglas Mawson, as these men all paid the price of believing that they were a match for the South"
> Uggggg! Private schoolboys with more money than sense.
Maybe it's just me, but if the most important part of your bio is which public school you went to, then something is lacking...
That second link at the top is spot on - although I'm not sure it's narcissism so much as wanting to carry on this tradition of British expeditioning, without really understanding what that entails. To quote that Andy Kirkpatrick post:
"Don’t believe the myths others have sewn about Antarctica, foolish macho heroism, or believe yourself tougher than the rest, that you are Shackleton, Scott or Douglas Mawson, as these men all paid the price of believing that they were a match for the South"
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In reply to ogreville:
All signs of incompetence and mismanagement, particularly in this day and age. He seems to think he's lining himself up to join some elite group - of maimed failures, blind to their own ineptitude?
It all reeks of the great British tradition of deliberately seeking out pointless suffering, all in the name of some vague notion of character traits and superiority, then weedling around the reasons for failure, all the while glorying in the attention.
It's like a national disease, a character flaw writ large in public, but mostly it's just a pathetic farce.
These youths seems to want praise for not sitting home staring at their phones (to paraphrase their own words). At their age, half the world's population have been out working for years just to support their families and avoid starving. The world is full of genuine suffering, unasked for and unpublicised. For cosseted, egotistical children of privilege to seek it out unnecessarily for personal fame and fortune, parried with such glib spin, is shameful and deserves criticism.
>
> A quote from 04:52 of Pilot Film on the website.
> A quote from 04:52 of Pilot Film on the website.
> "The Coldest Crossing is my personal chance to get a blistering face, blistering toes, possibly get frostbite, eyes that might freeze over and teeth that might fall out "
All signs of incompetence and mismanagement, particularly in this day and age. He seems to think he's lining himself up to join some elite group - of maimed failures, blind to their own ineptitude?
It all reeks of the great British tradition of deliberately seeking out pointless suffering, all in the name of some vague notion of character traits and superiority, then weedling around the reasons for failure, all the while glorying in the attention.
It's like a national disease, a character flaw writ large in public, but mostly it's just a pathetic farce.
These youths seems to want praise for not sitting home staring at their phones (to paraphrase their own words). At their age, half the world's population have been out working for years just to support their families and avoid starving. The world is full of genuine suffering, unasked for and unpublicised. For cosseted, egotistical children of privilege to seek it out unnecessarily for personal fame and fortune, parried with such glib spin, is shameful and deserves criticism.
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In reply to Damo:
I agree that there's lots that's ugly about TCC, and I agree that they may well be a contemporary expression of something in the British psyche. I have corresponded critically with their media person and I am not going to defend the team. I have, out of my embarrassment at their presumptuous dependency on being rescued, made a donation to Icelandic Search and Rescue,
BUT what about Thesiger and the silver spoon of Empire that he was born with; what if he hadn't succeeded in his Danakil crossing at the age of what, 21? What about Bonington - a poor, and in his youth probably rather pushy, little rich kid? What about Gordon Stainforth and his brother on Fiva? What about the well-known alpinist (forgotten who) who did the Walker Spur as his alpine second ascent, iirc? What about some of the pioneers of British rock climbing and their by our standards barely adequate gear?
TCC are victims of their own folly and of celebrity culture. But any of the above could have been, and perhaps were, criticized for folly and recklessness, and so, at times, could many of us on here.
I am, as I said, certainly not supporting them, but I do think that the Icelandic SAR person (mentioned in my earlier post) who saw a youthful version of himself in their eyes was onto something important.
I agree that there's lots that's ugly about TCC, and I agree that they may well be a contemporary expression of something in the British psyche. I have corresponded critically with their media person and I am not going to defend the team. I have, out of my embarrassment at their presumptuous dependency on being rescued, made a donation to Icelandic Search and Rescue,
BUT what about Thesiger and the silver spoon of Empire that he was born with; what if he hadn't succeeded in his Danakil crossing at the age of what, 21? What about Bonington - a poor, and in his youth probably rather pushy, little rich kid? What about Gordon Stainforth and his brother on Fiva? What about the well-known alpinist (forgotten who) who did the Walker Spur as his alpine second ascent, iirc? What about some of the pioneers of British rock climbing and their by our standards barely adequate gear?
TCC are victims of their own folly and of celebrity culture. But any of the above could have been, and perhaps were, criticized for folly and recklessness, and so, at times, could many of us on here.
I am, as I said, certainly not supporting them, but I do think that the Icelandic SAR person (mentioned in my earlier post) who saw a youthful version of himself in their eyes was onto something important.
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In reply to Solaris:
Wouldn't you eat some humble pie the moment you're being rescued once, twice, then three times? (I know I would). While I respect the SAR chief's words - I'm sure he only saw the boys on their best behavior and as such we might be cautious to take his words as any kind of character endorsement.
> I am, as I said, certainly not supporting them, but I do think that the Icelandic SAR person (mentioned in my earlier post) who saw a youthful version of himself in their eyes was onto something important.
Wouldn't you eat some humble pie the moment you're being rescued once, twice, then three times? (I know I would). While I respect the SAR chief's words - I'm sure he only saw the boys on their best behavior and as such we might be cautious to take his words as any kind of character endorsement.
Post edited at 12:05
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In reply to SenzuBean:
I completely agree about humble pie and as mentioned in my first post on this thread, it's worrying that they can't acknowledge in public that they've made some serious mistakes. I've also said this to their PR (Yuk!) person. On the other hand, wounded pride can make it hard to admit to ourselves, let alone tell others, that we've got things badly wrong.
I can't say much about the SAR person (not the "chief") because it was a private communication, but I think he was probably better informed about the team and what they were undertaking than most other Icelanders, and he certainly met them. Nor am I saying that he offered "endorsement" of any aspect of the team or their undertaking.
I think what he meant was that he could personally appreciate and identify with their enthusiasm for exploration and adventure, and their relish of risk. And which of us on here who's a keen climber can't say the same?
There's a statement of ICE-SAR's views here: https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5551bd76e4b0872f41a62cbd/t/568582f1e...
Also of interest is that although the (Icelandic) Isalp guy in the second link in the OP is critical, he doesn't give them nearly as hard a time as many Icelanders and some climbers on here.
I completely agree about humble pie and as mentioned in my first post on this thread, it's worrying that they can't acknowledge in public that they've made some serious mistakes. I've also said this to their PR (Yuk!) person. On the other hand, wounded pride can make it hard to admit to ourselves, let alone tell others, that we've got things badly wrong.
I can't say much about the SAR person (not the "chief") because it was a private communication, but I think he was probably better informed about the team and what they were undertaking than most other Icelanders, and he certainly met them. Nor am I saying that he offered "endorsement" of any aspect of the team or their undertaking.
I think what he meant was that he could personally appreciate and identify with their enthusiasm for exploration and adventure, and their relish of risk. And which of us on here who's a keen climber can't say the same?
There's a statement of ICE-SAR's views here: https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5551bd76e4b0872f41a62cbd/t/568582f1e...
Also of interest is that although the (Icelandic) Isalp guy in the second link in the OP is critical, he doesn't give them nearly as hard a time as many Icelanders and some climbers on here.
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In reply to Solaris:
To the anonymous person who disliked my post, I'd be interested to know what you disliked about it.
That I criticized the team and warned them before they set out; that I agreed with Damo about the British psyche; that I gave some money to ICE-SAR; that I've brought our own tradition to mind and tried to remind us of things that (probably) all of us have done; that I have tried to express a significant Icelander's point of view; or that I have attempted to elicit a modicum sympathy for people when they've failed on something and are feeling down?
To the anonymous person who disliked my post, I'd be interested to know what you disliked about it.
That I criticized the team and warned them before they set out; that I agreed with Damo about the British psyche; that I gave some money to ICE-SAR; that I've brought our own tradition to mind and tried to remind us of things that (probably) all of us have done; that I have tried to express a significant Icelander's point of view; or that I have attempted to elicit a modicum sympathy for people when they've failed on something and are feeling down?
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