In reply to HappyTrundler:
> (In reply to The Green Giant)
>
> Average UK climbing grade HVS??? I can't believe any climber could think that, let alone HVS to E2??!! The average climbing grade in the UK is about Hard Severere to VS maximum, you've only got to go to a crag to see that...you can't take the log books on here as evidence, more climbers are off here than on here....
Your example is as flawed as any other - go to Stanage on a sunny Sunday and the average will be about Severe, but go to Cloggy, Gogarth, Avon Main wall, Scafell etc. and the average grade will be about E2. Then throw in Goredale, LPT and Malham to completely screw the picture... For what it's worth, I agree with you. Survey after survey always comes out with an average grade of around VS, and that seems reasonable. Climbers in the UK are just a bunch of bumblies, and we're quite happy with that!
For what it's worth, I do think that we overhype the difficulty and danger of trad climbing in the UK, which does hold us back, but there is a fine balance to be struck between confidence and recklessness.
Im my experience, I would guess that while UK bumblies are at Stanage, the french bumblies are on the alpine peaks rather than the crags.
Anyway, if everyone's happy doing what they are doing, what's the problem.