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In the last few days I've climbed both Goliath's Groove and Bond Street and got to the top thinking that I could climb harder things in a similar style.
So, what are the E1 climber's version of these two routes? Or indeed any good cracks or corners at that grade.
I have only 2 requirements: No overhanging things (I have no stamina) or laybacking (unless it can be jammed around).
So, what are the E1 climber's version of these two routes? Or indeed any good cracks or corners at that grade.
I have only 2 requirements: No overhanging things (I have no stamina) or laybacking (unless it can be jammed around).
In reply to victim of mathematics:
Jibber, Monks Buttress.
http://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/c.php?i=25494
Jibber, Monks Buttress.
http://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/c.php?i=25494
In reply to victim of mathematics:
The E1 equivalent of Bond Street is this: http://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/c.php?i=10724
Straight-in jamming (mostly), well-protected and easy for the grade. No sneaking off left, obviously. To get the E1 it has to be a bit steep and sustained though.
The E1 equivalent of Bond Street is this: http://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/c.php?i=10724
Straight-in jamming (mostly), well-protected and easy for the grade. No sneaking off left, obviously. To get the E1 it has to be a bit steep and sustained though.
In reply to victim of mathematics:
IMHO anyone who can climb Goliath's Groove can easily climb Long Tall Sally. The crux of which is a bridged corner crack.
IMHO anyone who can climb Goliath's Groove can easily climb Long Tall Sally. The crux of which is a bridged corner crack.
In reply to victim of mathematics:
I see where you're coming from, but there's a curious lack of E1 jamming cracks in the Peak. I think if the older generation can do them they're reluctant to give them more than HVS and if they can't they 'must be' E2 or more, leaving a rare breed of route that is still possible at that sort of grade but only if you have a particular bent towards that type of climbing!
Dexterity was a very good suggestion.
I see where you're coming from, but there's a curious lack of E1 jamming cracks in the Peak. I think if the older generation can do them they're reluctant to give them more than HVS and if they can't they 'must be' E2 or more, leaving a rare breed of route that is still possible at that sort of grade but only if you have a particular bent towards that type of climbing!
Dexterity was a very good suggestion.
In reply to john arran:
That's an interesting theory.
I've seconded Big Crack some time ago and found getting to the crack to be desperately pumpy. I don't recall any jamming though, it's a bit wide! Left Eliminate looks a lot harder than Right Eliminate to me for some reason. I've belayed a friend on Zeus and I got pumped just looking at it. I've never really looked at The Unprintable, but I'm sure I've heard the crux involves laybacking against knees, or some other nonsense.
I'm just as interested in non-Peak suggestions. Perhaps Emulator at Gogarth?
That's an interesting theory.
I've seconded Big Crack some time ago and found getting to the crack to be desperately pumpy. I don't recall any jamming though, it's a bit wide! Left Eliminate looks a lot harder than Right Eliminate to me for some reason. I've belayed a friend on Zeus and I got pumped just looking at it. I've never really looked at The Unprintable, but I'm sure I've heard the crux involves laybacking against knees, or some other nonsense.
I'm just as interested in non-Peak suggestions. Perhaps Emulator at Gogarth?
In reply to victim of mathematics:
Tower Chimney and Tower crack might suit you sir.
Marble wall area has a couple of interesting things as well.
Tower Chimney and Tower crack might suit you sir.
Marble wall area has a couple of interesting things as well.
In reply to sutty:
Tower Crack looks fun (although it is only HVS), but Tower Chimney looks ludicrous. Like a big bit of Ramshaw relocated to the other side of the Peak!
Tower Crack looks fun (although it is only HVS), but Tower Chimney looks ludicrous. Like a big bit of Ramshaw relocated to the other side of the Peak!
I can think of one very obvious corner with a crack in it.
Interestingly, Goliath's Groove is far more polished than 'above'. I guess peoples fear of blowing their 'on-sight' can be a good thing!
Interestingly, Goliath's Groove is far more polished than 'above'. I guess peoples fear of blowing their 'on-sight' can be a good thing!
In reply to victim of mathematics:
Get to Yorkshire, get to Ilkley Quarry, and get up Tufted Crack!
(Though the fact that I've seen a John Dunne quote where he thinks its really E2, and anything that obvious in a location _that_ popular and "merely" E1, not getting its first clean lead until 1971 should suggest to you the calibre of the climber required...) :-O
P.
Get to Yorkshire, get to Ilkley Quarry, and get up Tufted Crack!
(Though the fact that I've seen a John Dunne quote where he thinks its really E2, and anything that obvious in a location _that_ popular and "merely" E1, not getting its first clean lead until 1971 should suggest to you the calibre of the climber required...) :-O
P.
In reply to PontiusPirate:
He could also do Botterills while he is there, a mere VS, in the book. Fred must have been good.
He could also do Botterills while he is there, a mere VS, in the book. Fred must have been good.
In reply to victim of mathematics: http://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/c.php?i=4300
I remember this being very good.
I remember this being very good.
In reply to flaneur:
Agree that Dexterity is brilliant, it's is the E1 version of Bond Street. Though many will argue it is only HVS. I fell off it though so it must be E1.
Agree that Dexterity is brilliant, it's is the E1 version of Bond Street. Though many will argue it is only HVS. I fell off it though so it must be E1.
In reply to victim of mathematics:
What about embankment 3 and embankment 4?
They are thinner than Bond street (both finger jamming) but still non-overhanging jamming cracks.
What about embankment 3 and embankment 4?
They are thinner than Bond street (both finger jamming) but still non-overhanging jamming cracks.
In reply to victim of mathematics:
The best E1 crack I've done is probably Indy500, Although you can look at Strait Gate or Rock Idol as good contenders. On grit, there is Galeileo or Encouragement. Also Fruitanflancase on Dewerstone.
The problem with E1 cracks is that given that they will be protected and they are a continuous hold, they generally have to be steep to warrant the grade.
The best E1 crack I've done is probably Indy500, Although you can look at Strait Gate or Rock Idol as good contenders. On grit, there is Galeileo or Encouragement. Also Fruitanflancase on Dewerstone.
The problem with E1 cracks is that given that they will be protected and they are a continuous hold, they generally have to be steep to warrant the grade.
In reply to victim of mathematics:
And for steep - try Mars or Kraken. Both a lot more amenable than their ridiculous angle might suggest.
And for steep - try Mars or Kraken. Both a lot more amenable than their ridiculous angle might suggest.
In reply to PontiusPirate:
...Brimham to avoid the sandbags and climb Frensis direct - a 5b corner above gear at the top of a VS crack for E1***. I must do this...
> Get to Yorkshire, get to
...Brimham to avoid the sandbags and climb Frensis direct - a 5b corner above gear at the top of a VS crack for E1***. I must do this...
In reply to johnjohn: Frensis direct isnt a corner most of the way though, its a hanging layback/jamming crack with the only thing that could be remotely described as a "corner" - its more of an awkward groove - right at the top. having done goliaths groove fairly, but still finding frensis in any of its variations completely ferocious I would say the techniques needed and characters of these routes are very different.
In reply to victim of mathematics:
Thats because Right Eliminate is mega deceptive, it's much harder than it looks.
How about Medusa at Stoney (warm up on Minus Ten), or Aladdinsane at Trowbarrow (with Jean Jeanie as a warm up), actually this route is historic in that it was Ron Fawcetts first major new route.
On Cyrn Las there is the great classic, The Grooves, where you get three pitches of the type you are after.
> (In reply to john arran)
>
> That's an interesting theory.
>
> I've seconded Big Crack some time ago and found getting to the crack to be desperately pumpy. I don't recall any jamming though, it's a bit wide! Left Eliminate looks a lot harder than Right Eliminate to me for some reason.
>
> That's an interesting theory.
>
> I've seconded Big Crack some time ago and found getting to the crack to be desperately pumpy. I don't recall any jamming though, it's a bit wide! Left Eliminate looks a lot harder than Right Eliminate to me for some reason.
Thats because Right Eliminate is mega deceptive, it's much harder than it looks.
How about Medusa at Stoney (warm up on Minus Ten), or Aladdinsane at Trowbarrow (with Jean Jeanie as a warm up), actually this route is historic in that it was Ron Fawcetts first major new route.
On Cyrn Las there is the great classic, The Grooves, where you get three pitches of the type you are after.
In reply to pebbles:
...I stand corrected: a groove at the top of a (very good) VS crack.
In terms of technique, when I erm, looked at it* I recall wedging myself sideways at one point thinking 'no this isn't the way', before desparate scrabbly moves right edge got me up, just.
*top rope justification - just led Frensis and gone back for a bit of grear my 2nd had left, easier to finish direct despite blowing some notional future onsight yadda yadda
...I stand corrected: a groove at the top of a (very good) VS crack.
In terms of technique, when I erm, looked at it* I recall wedging myself sideways at one point thinking 'no this isn't the way', before desparate scrabbly moves right edge got me up, just.
*top rope justification - just led Frensis and gone back for a bit of grear my 2nd had left, easier to finish direct despite blowing some notional future onsight yadda yadda
In reply to victim of mathematics:
You should get yourself to Fairhead. Lots and lots of long, sustained, E1 jamming crack pleasure.
The rock forms big hexagonal columns, so you quite often get lots of bridging/jamming in corners/boxes, as well as plenty of straight-in jams.
Plenty of opportunities for textbook gear placements make it a really good place to push your grade.
Routes on offer are 40m single pitch up to about 120m multipitch.
Best place in the UK I have been for jamming cracks IMHO.
You should get yourself to Fairhead. Lots and lots of long, sustained, E1 jamming crack pleasure.
The rock forms big hexagonal columns, so you quite often get lots of bridging/jamming in corners/boxes, as well as plenty of straight-in jams.
Plenty of opportunities for textbook gear placements make it a really good place to push your grade.
Routes on offer are 40m single pitch up to about 120m multipitch.
Best place in the UK I have been for jamming cracks IMHO.
In reply to victim of mathematics:
Hen Cloud has lots of what you are looking for. Delstree, HC Eliminate (both 'HVS' but would be E1 at somewhere soft like Stanage), possibly Encouragement (corner on the first pitch, excellent crack on the second but E1 even at Hen Cloud!).
I have to agree with Al the the Grooves would be a great trip for this sort of thing and a reasonably easy tick for E1.
Hen Cloud has lots of what you are looking for. Delstree, HC Eliminate (both 'HVS' but would be E1 at somewhere soft like Stanage), possibly Encouragement (corner on the first pitch, excellent crack on the second but E1 even at Hen Cloud!).
I have to agree with Al the the Grooves would be a great trip for this sort of thing and a reasonably easy tick for E1.
In reply to victim of mathematics: Emulator at Gogarth is a good, sustained E1 corner (used to be HVS).
Suicide Groove (E1 5b, used to be HVS) and Rampart Corner (E1 5c) at Idwal are also good corners for practising bridging. Herford's Crack, also at Idwal (HVS in the Ground Up guide, but VS if you like that sort of thing) is a great straight-in jamming crack - much better than Bond Street!
On grit The Trident (E1 or HVS) at Wimberry would be a worthwhile target - a perfect jamming crack at the back of an overhanging pod, but it is possible to rest between moves, if you don't mind taking the skin off your knees. Someone else has already mentioned Long Tall Sally at Burbage.
I'd say both the ones you mention are low end HVS, so don't get carried away!
Suicide Groove (E1 5b, used to be HVS) and Rampart Corner (E1 5c) at Idwal are also good corners for practising bridging. Herford's Crack, also at Idwal (HVS in the Ground Up guide, but VS if you like that sort of thing) is a great straight-in jamming crack - much better than Bond Street!
On grit The Trident (E1 or HVS) at Wimberry would be a worthwhile target - a perfect jamming crack at the back of an overhanging pod, but it is possible to rest between moves, if you don't mind taking the skin off your knees. Someone else has already mentioned Long Tall Sally at Burbage.
I'd say both the ones you mention are low end HVS, so don't get carried away!
In reply to Rob Davies:
Well thats true, classic VS's really, at the risk of repetition have you done The File yet?
> (In reply to victim of mathematics) Emulator at Gogarth is a good, I'd say both the ones you mention are low end HVS, so don't get carried away!
Well thats true, classic VS's really, at the risk of repetition have you done The File yet?
In reply to Al Evans:
I have indeed done The File, and The Crank, and Great Zawn (although that's more of a weird chimney thing) and plenty of other VS cracks about the place.
Thanks for all the suggestions, Emulator, Aladdinsane and The Grooves were already possibilities, but it's good to have a bit more to get inspired by. I like the recommendations of good HVS jamming cracks too, especially outside the Peak.
Would Grey Panther at Kilt Rock be a good 'un? It certainly looks pretty amazing.
I have indeed done The File, and The Crank, and Great Zawn (although that's more of a weird chimney thing) and plenty of other VS cracks about the place.
Thanks for all the suggestions, Emulator, Aladdinsane and The Grooves were already possibilities, but it's good to have a bit more to get inspired by. I like the recommendations of good HVS jamming cracks too, especially outside the Peak.
Would Grey Panther at Kilt Rock be a good 'un? It certainly looks pretty amazing.
In reply to victim of mathematics:
Barbarian at Pant Ifan might fit the bill. It's no pushover but not a sandbag either. Features two overhangs too.
Barbarian at Pant Ifan might fit the bill. It's no pushover but not a sandbag either. Features two overhangs too.
In reply to victim of mathematics:
Razor Crack on Neckband crag in Langdale fits the bill - was top of the HVS graded list when I did it, but bottom of the E1 list in the current guide, and it's a cracking route. North facing though - one for hot dry summer weather.
Razor Crack on Neckband crag in Langdale fits the bill - was top of the HVS graded list when I did it, but bottom of the E1 list in the current guide, and it's a cracking route. North facing though - one for hot dry summer weather.
In reply to victim of mathematics:
Beyond the Azimuth at Barcud
Oesophagus at Chudleigh
Mandrake on Quayfoot Buttress, Borrowdale
A real corker I've just though of is Gillian at Sennen. It was E1 when I did it.
> (In reply to Al Evans)
>
I like the recommendations of good HVS jamming cracks too, especially outside the Peak.>
>
Beyond the Azimuth at Barcud
Oesophagus at Chudleigh
Mandrake on Quayfoot Buttress, Borrowdale
A real corker I've just though of is Gillian at Sennen. It was E1 when I did it.
In reply to Dave Garnett:
yeah second medusa at stoney and dexterity at millstone.
the grond on the cromlech.
gates of mordor at millstone, ringlock jams.
Zapple at yarncliffe.
yeah second medusa at stoney and dexterity at millstone.
the grond on the cromlech.
gates of mordor at millstone, ringlock jams.
Zapple at yarncliffe.
In reply to victim of mathematics:
If you want an E1 hand-jamming crack with no laybacking and no overhangs, the only two I can think of are Dexterity and Suicide Wall (which gets HVS probably but it's worth E1 if done in one pitch -a belay rest is cheating). They are both still total stamina-fests though, even thoguh they have no overhangs!
The fact is that hand-jamming without an overhang can never be that hard.
Most of the suggestions on this thread dont meet your criteria though. If you want any crack-line (not just hand-jamming), I could name a lot more and on other rock-types - but they wont necessarily feel anything like Bond Street or Goliath's Groove.
If you want an E1 hand-jamming crack with no laybacking and no overhangs, the only two I can think of are Dexterity and Suicide Wall (which gets HVS probably but it's worth E1 if done in one pitch -a belay rest is cheating). They are both still total stamina-fests though, even thoguh they have no overhangs!
The fact is that hand-jamming without an overhang can never be that hard.
Most of the suggestions on this thread dont meet your criteria though. If you want any crack-line (not just hand-jamming), I could name a lot more and on other rock-types - but they wont necessarily feel anything like Bond Street or Goliath's Groove.
In reply to Si dH:
By the way, Tower Chimney is much easier than several Ramshaw E1s.
By the way, Tower Chimney is much easier than several Ramshaw E1s.
In reply to victim of mathematics:
Emulator at gogarth is hard for the grade! Get amongst it tho it's a top route. Other routes at e1 in Wales are , the grooves on cyrn las, cenotaph corner, cemetary gates (HVS) the strand is amazing, only e1 but for 25 m so worthy of e2. Get on right unconquerable so u can get used to laybacking, then try stuff like elder crack, l'horla, bond street, and the awesome "the mau mau"
remember, our strengths are our weaknesses, your weakness is the ability to jam, learn to layback
centurion05
Emulator at gogarth is hard for the grade! Get amongst it tho it's a top route. Other routes at e1 in Wales are , the grooves on cyrn las, cenotaph corner, cemetary gates (HVS) the strand is amazing, only e1 but for 25 m so worthy of e2. Get on right unconquerable so u can get used to laybacking, then try stuff like elder crack, l'horla, bond street, and the awesome "the mau mau"
remember, our strengths are our weaknesses, your weakness is the ability to jam, learn to layback
centurion05
In reply to Dave Garnett: I think Golva is E2 now Dave, last time I was at Sennon, Gerry led it when it was sopping wet! Another good E1 jamming crack at Sennen is Congo Crack E1 5b.
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